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Thread: Evidence/ testimonies of Michael's business/ artistic insecurities

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    Evidence/ testimonies of Michael's business/ artistic insecurities

    This could be a very interesting thread.

    Michael used his tremendous influence and control of the Beatles’ catalog to ensure that my way was compromised. I can honestly stand before God at Judgment and testify that the great Master Jackson was a bona fide, life changing ‘pain in my ass’, the 800 pound Gorilla in the room never mentioned but always felt, if not seen. He hated me…and yet, circumstances being as we find them, none of that made him any less a Hero to me for all that he had already done to inspire my youth, and coming together as a servant of the music.

    - Terrence Trent D'Arby


    The music icon apparently became obsessed with the Irish rock group following the success of their 1988 album 'The Joshua Tree' and so he attempted to send a private film crew to Dublin to tape U2 in the studio in order to uncover their secrets.

    But Michael's plan was uncovered by U2's manager Paul McGuinness, who considered it to be a bit "creepy".

    Lead singer Bono told The Sun newspaper: "Michael wanted to observe us in our natural habitat."


    - https://www.msn.com/en-gb/entertainm...-u2/ar-BByuGwA

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    Dingbat,
    I have read this before, but even if this was the first time, I would just say it is not surprising that MJ did anything he could to be seen on top at all times. Sad in a way as again it points to huge insecurity and jealousy of other artists when he never really had to feel threatened. He could not stand someone having success, even if that success would have paled in comparison to his own.

    He simply could not share a tidbit, this outlook in the end made the last decade or two of his life even harder than it should have been. You cannot stay on top forever. I think that was real hard to deal with for him. Being at the pinnacle and inevitably having to come down the mountain probably led to all kinds of negatives.

    I recall somewhere I read that MJ turned down Janet's voice on the song scream, which she did not agree to. I think if this is true that he did it to sound better and more the focus of the song.

    MJ hiring Jermaine's producers out from under him (though I blame those producers as they chose to move) Then Word to the Badd comes out, and some how just disappears into space never heard again.

    PG stated in a thread once when I asked him why MJ hired such sucky dancers, PG (and others I have talked to with backgrounds in dance) have said it was an ego thing to make MJ look better on film and stage. I do not know if this is true TBH, but very well might be.

    Dani
    Last edited by Danileevan; 06-03-2017 at 05:26 AM.
    "Take my message to your brother and tell em twice"

    "Dancing the Dream"

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    Honestly, if I was to write a MJ biography, one common thread I keep coming back to while studying his life is man was the guy super-insecure. He just wasn't comfortable in his own skin, almost literally in his case really. He was obsessed with staying on top, and seemed to be searching for meaning in his life. It's actually quite sad.

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  6. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Danileevan View Post
    MJ hiring Jermaine's producers out from under him (though I blame those producers as they chose to move) Then “Word to The Badd” comes out, and some how just disappears into space never heard again.

    Dani

    http://www.historycontinues.com/foru...ad.php?p=76466

    Quote Originally Posted by DDFF22552255 View Post
    ^^YES, ——, I believe, too, that Jermaine was really jealous of Michael and his eventual success. Do you remember a song that Jermaine had almost released, around the same time that Michael’s album, “Dangerous,” was coming out, called “Word to The Badd”? The lyrics of the song basically criticized, and made nasty remarks about, his younger brother’s changing physical appearance, at first. Re-written lyrics were later made public on the version that was released, about an anonymous person who (allegedly) did something unspecified. I strongly believe the same thing you do, because, Jermaine was the original lead vocalist for an early version of the group that would later be known as The Jackson 5 — who would begin a very successful career at Motown — until Michael was brought into it, to take over as lead vocalist from Jermaine. Do you think that was the case? I would like to know.

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    MJ parted company with his longtime producer Quincy Jones right after the BAD album.

    But some years later, MJ did call Quincy during the final stages of the production of his ‘Dangerous’ album in order to approve the nearly completed tracks that MJ along with Teddy Riley produced (which were to make his upcoming ‘Dangerous’ album).

    This was also confirmed by Teddy Riley himself, for example: “… Michael brought Quincy in to hear it – he was like a quality controller for Michael… He [Quincy] did hear this album… and he [Quincy] said that it’s ready to come out…” (Teddy Riley)

    I believe this incident (calling Quincy to approve the tracks for the ‘Dangerous’ album) showed some sort of artistic insecurities on the part of MJ.

    By the way, this is indeed a very interesting thread.

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    Probably goes back to his childhood trying to please his father. He had all this talent and his father never gave him that thumbs up or told him "you did well, son", that he wanted to badly hear from him so that definitely made him a very insecure man once he became a successful adult superstar. Like despite the fact he sold more albums than almost everyone, he never was satisfied with that. He had to be #1 all the time or he was a failure. This is the same man who in 1986 told his producers his follow-up to the best-selling album of all time should "sell no more than 100 million copies". And since Thriller had done over 40 million by that point, he felt he could prove people wrong as he did in 1982. That wasn't to be but that didn't stop him, hence all the stuff he did to promote the record, including an ego-boosting documentary going over his whole career, the Moonwalker film, the tour, hiring Martin Scorsese to direct one of his videos, etc. And even after all of that, the record "only" did over 40 million worldwide while Thriller began to set itself as a successful catalog seller at that point. The same guy who got all the music channels and ONE MAJOR to broadcast a music video so it could help to boost Dangerous sales and HIStory sales, yet those albums also didn't match what he managed to achieve with Thriller, already repeating what he did with that album. What made Thriller special commercially is no other music album had ever had the attention of the world like Thriller in the ways MJ and his label (most of the time) pushed it: the landmark music videos that broke the color barrier, having a rock song, the first music video "world premier" that was also a mini-film with a hot director of the time (John Landis), the talk of the moonwalk, even the Victory tour. Like MJ wanted to match that and when he couldn't, it increased his anxiety. He had to be the best or it wasn't worth it. This is why Gerald Levert, George Michael and Prince had short lives as well because they were just as ambitious and if their records weren't received very well, they retreaded (well maybe not Gerald since his success was more limiting as an R&B artist but if you saw his Unsung, he had similarities to MJ in pushing for that success).
    I was a king under your control...

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  10. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by TroubleMan84 View Post
    Probably goes back to his childhood trying to please his father. He had all this talent and his father never gave him that thumbs up or told him "you did well, son", that he wanted to badly hear from him so that definitely made him a very insecure man once he became a successful adult superstar. Like despite the fact he sold more albums than almost everyone, he never was satisfied with that. He had to be #1 all the time or he was a failure. This is the same man who in 1986 told his producers his follow-up to the best-selling album of all time should "sell no more than 100 million copies". And since Thriller had done over 40 million by that point, he felt he could prove people wrong as he did in 1982. That wasn't to be but that didn't stop him, hence all the stuff he did to promote the record, including an ego-boosting documentary going over his whole career, the Moonwalker film, the tour, hiring Martin Scorsese to direct one of his videos, etc. And even after all of that, the record "only" did over 40 million worldwide while Thriller began to set itself as a successful catalog seller at that point. The same guy who got all the music channels and ONE MAJOR to broadcast a music video so it could help to boost Dangerous sales and HIStory sales, yet those albums also didn't match what he managed to achieve with Thriller, already repeating what he did with that album. What made Thriller special commercially is no other music album had ever had the attention of the world like Thriller in the ways MJ and his label (most of the time) pushed it: the landmark music videos that broke the color barrier, having a rock song, the first music video "world premier" that was also a mini-film with a hot director of the time (John Landis), the talk of the moonwalk, even the Victory tour. Like MJ wanted to match that and when he couldn't, it increased his anxiety. He had to be the best or it wasn't worth it. This is why Gerald Levert, George Michael and Prince had short lives as well because they were just as ambitious and if their records weren't received very well, they retreaded (well maybe not Gerald since his success was more limiting as an R&B artist but if you saw his Unsung, he had similarities to MJ in pushing for that success).
    from 1987-1989 during it's original run, Bad sold 25 million copies worldwide......that's why MJ fired his manager and eventually changed record producers.....

    since that time, cumulatively, it probably has sold 40 million...

    and R&B music, real r&b has served to be the lifeline of all the major music genres that has excelled commercially over the past quarter century.....until there was nothing else to tap into...

    --- Merged Posts ---

    Quote Originally Posted by mj_frenzy View Post
    MJ parted company with his longtime producer Quincy Jones right after the BAD album.

    But some years later, MJ did call Quincy during the final stages of the production of his ‘Dangerous’ album in order to approve the nearly completed tracks that MJ along with Teddy Riley produced (which were to make his upcoming ‘Dangerous’ album).

    This was also confirmed by Teddy Riley himself, for example: “… Michael brought Quincy in to hear it – he was like a quality controller for Michael… He [Quincy] did hear this album… and he [Quincy] said that it’s ready to come out…” (Teddy Riley)

    I believe this incident (calling Quincy to approve the tracks for the ‘Dangerous’ album) showed some sort of artistic insecurities on the part of MJ.

    By the way, this is indeed a very interesting thread.

    very true

    When it was first announced that when Michael Jackson first called on Teddy Riley to product the follow up to Bad, there was an initial report that Quincy Jones actually made that suggestion.

    I can see this being true considering that MJ had Quincy listen to the finished work prior to Dangerous release.

    I never had a problem with MJ working with someone else because MJ/Quincy already proved they made history together and was the most successful artist/producer collaboration in music history......

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    I also believe his self-title ‘King Of Pop, Rock & Soul’ shows some insecurity on his part.

    In late 80’s, MJ desperately wanted a moniker like Bruce Springsteen, Frank Sinatra & Elvis Presley.

    So, Bob Jones (his manager at that time) came up with that title & he bestowed on MJ.

    MJ even ordered from Bob Jones to give out press releases which stated that MJ had to be called ‘King Of Pop’.

    Quote Originally Posted by TroubleMan84 View Post
    This is the same man who in 1986 told his producers his follow-up to the best-selling album of all time should "sell no more than 100 million copies". And since Thriller had done over 40 million by that point, he felt he could prove people wrong as he did in 1982. That wasn't to be but that didn't stop him, hence all the stuff he did to promote the record, including an ego-boosting documentary going over his whole career, the Moonwalker film, the tour, hiring Martin Scorsese to direct one of his videos, etc. And even after all of that, the record "only" did over 40 million worldwide while Thriller began to set itself as a successful catalog seller at that point. The same guy who got all the music channels and ONE MAJOR to broadcast a music video so it could help to boost Dangerous sales and HIStory sales, yet those albums also didn't match what he managed to achieve with Thriller, already repeating what he did with that album.
    MJ even wanted 100 million sales even with his ‘Invincible’ album.

    There were stickers (that MJ wrote on them ‘100 millions’) on the studio walls during the ‘Invincible’ recording sessions (confirmed by various people who visited him there, including Marsha Ambrosius).

    Quote Originally Posted by Just Another Part of Me View Post
    from 1987-1989 during it's original run, Bad sold 25 million copies worldwide......that's why MJ fired his manager and eventually changed record
    I think there were other main reasons as well for firing his at the time manager & eventually changing his record producers (such as, failing to win any Grammy Awards with his ‘Bad’ album).

    Quote Originally Posted by Just Another Part of Me View Post
    When it was first announced that when Michael Jackson first called on Teddy Riley to product the follow up to Bad, there was an initial report that Quincy Jones actually made that suggestion.

    I can see this being true considering that MJ had Quincy listen to the finished work prior to Dangerous release.
    Quincy Jones originally wanted from Teddy Riley to work with him on the ‘BAD’ album.

    But there were some management issues that did not allow Teddy Riley to work with Quincy on that album back then.

    So, Teddy Riley eventually ended up working on MJ’s next album (‘Dangerous’) on Quincy Jones’ recommendation.

    That initial report you are referring to is true.

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  14. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by mj_frenzy View Post
    I also believe his self-title ‘King Of Pop, Rock & Soul’ shows some insecurity on his part.

    In late 80’s, MJ desperately wanted a moniker like Bruce Springsteen, Frank Sinatra & Elvis Presley.

    So, Bob Jones (his manager at that time) came up with that title & he bestowed on MJ.

    MJ even ordered from Bob Jones to give out press releases which stated that MJ had to be called ‘King Of Pop’.



    MJ even wanted 100 million sales even with his ‘Invincible’ album.

    There were stickers (that MJ wrote on them ‘100 millions’) on the studio walls during the ‘Invincible’ recording sessions (confirmed by various people who visited him there, including Marsha Ambrosius).



    I think there were other main reasons as well for firing his at the time manager & eventually changing his record producers (such as, failing to win any Grammy Awards with his ‘Bad’ album).



    Quincy Jones originally wanted from Teddy Riley to work with him on the ‘BAD’ album.

    But there were some management issues that did not allow Teddy Riley to work with Quincy on that album back then.

    So, Teddy Riley eventually ended up working on MJ’s next album (‘Dangerous’) on Quincy Jones’ recommendation.

    That initial report you are referring to is true.


    good points, and very true

    it was a major slight that MJ did not win any awards during the 88 Grammys

    George Michael had a great album out in 87-88 with Faith, and I had to admit he deserved the recognition but MJ should have won something......

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    I don't think the Grammys wanted him to sweep like he did in 1984 with Thriller, they were defiantly conscious of that, and Bad wasn't as good as Thriller critically either. He should have won Best Male Pop Vocal Performance for the Bad single though.

    Album of the Year was out of the question though, mainly because Faith was ****ing incredible.

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